Forum Romanum


Subject:	Re: [Nova-Roma] Devolved vs. Federal
From:	"L. Sicinius Drusus" <lsicinius@yahoo.com>
Date:	Sun, 8 Dec 2002 16:08:31 -0800 (PST)

--- me-in-@disguise.co.uk wrote:
> -----Original Message-----
> From : “L. Sicinius Drusus“ <lsicinius@yahoo.com>
> >
> >In Antiquita the government that mattered the most
> the
> >people living in the provinces was the government
> of
> >thier city. They had varrying degrees of control
> over
> >this government depending on local customs which
> could
> >be modified at the descretion of the Propraetor or
> >
> Doesn't that amount to a federation of cities?
>
> Caesariensis.
>
>
To an extent it was a de facto federation, but never a
de jure federation. Most cities were conquered
territories bound to Roma by treaties which allowed
varring degrees of local government depending on the
terms of the treaty dictated to them. Retaining this
limited self government depended on good behavior not
on any recognized Federal princapals. Others were
colonies of Roman citizens who would be under Roman
law rather than local customs, but still bound to Roma
by the Lex that established the colony.

My personal view is the best way to recreate the
status the cities had would be to replace the treaties
with Charters that the Senate would grant to local
groups sitting up thier relationship with Nova Roma's
Government. We could also have some varity in these
local groups by having different "treaties" sitting up
a Municipia, a Polis or perhaps some other historic
variation, leaving it up to the civies forming the
local group which type of local government they wanted
as thier "local custom".

=====
L. Sicinius Drusus

Roman Citizen

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Subject:	[Nova-Roma] Re: Nova!
From:	"Gnaeus Equitius Marinus <equitius_marinus@yahoo.com>" <equitius_marinus@yahoo.com>
Date:	Mon, 09 Dec 2002 01:59:35 -0000

T.Junius Romanus writes:

> Ave!Everyone I am Junius,I am new to this group and would like to
> say hello to everyone.

And you did!

Hi Junius, it's a pleasure to have you here. Welcome to the
forum. We have a lot of interesting folks here. Are you new
to both Nova Roma and this mailing list? If so, would you like
a little help getting to know your way around?

I'm Gnaeus Equitius Marinus. I hang around here to see what's
going to happen next.

-- Marinus

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Subject:	[Nova-Roma] Re: Nova!
From:	"T.Junius Romanus <titan_242002@yahoo.com>" <titan_242002@yahoo.com>
Date:	Mon, 09 Dec 2002 02:44:15 -0000

Hello Equitas,Yes I am new to both.I have been pagan since mid
oct,But not Roman until recently.I have chosen the Roman way because
it seems to fit with my veiws of Paganism and I love the Roman
pantheon,art and architecture.And from what I have read on the Nova
Roma website I also agree with the Roman way of life.Yes any help
would be appreciated.Thanks Junius.
ps how would feb.20,1967 and 2002 be written in Latin?(both literally
and according to the Nova Roma dating of the years.)is it 2755 and
how do you come up with that?

--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "Gnaeus Equitius Marinus
<equitius_marinus@y...>" <equitius_marinus@y...> wrote:
> T.Junius Romanus writes:
>
> > Ave!Everyone I am Junius,I am new to this group and would like to
> > say hello to everyone.
>
> And you did!
>
> Hi Junius, it's a pleasure to have you here. Welcome to the
> forum. We have a lot of interesting folks here. Are you new
> to both Nova Roma and this mailing list? If so, would you like
> a little help getting to know your way around?
>
> I'm Gnaeus Equitius Marinus. I hang around here to see what's
> going to happen next.
>
> -- Marinus

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Subject:	[Nova-Roma] Re: Nova!
From:	"Gnaeus Equitius Marinus <equitius_marinus@yahoo.com>" <equitius_marinus@yahoo.com>
Date:	Mon, 09 Dec 2002 05:25:58 -0000

T.Junius Romanus writes:

> Hello Equitas,Yes I am new to both.

OK, so you're just learning your way around. Let me recommend
a few things.

The guide for new citizens can be found at

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Nova-Roma/files/Moderator%27s%20Orientation%20for%20New%20Citizens

You should already have gotten a copy when you joined the mailing
list, but just in case you didn't, or you deleted it, you can
always find it in the Files section at the URL listed above.

We refer to this list (Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com) as "the mainlist"
a lot. There are something like 90 other yahoo lists related to
Nova Roma as well, including sodalites, provincial lists, and some
fun things that you'll read about over the course of time.

Here in the mainlist, we hold our forum. That means that you'll
often see a lot of political discussion and debate here. Some
people love it, while others don't much care for it. If you'd
rather pass on the politics, there's still a lot of Nova Roma to
see in the many other discussion lists out there.

> I have been pagan since mid
> oct,But not Roman until recently.I have chosen the Roman way because
> it seems to fit with my veiws of Paganism and I love the Roman
> pantheon,art and architecture.

There's a Religio Romana list I'll recommend to you. You can
find the information about how to join it either by searching
Yahoo or at the Religio section of our home website

http://novaroma.org/religio_romana/

We have some really fine people here who are active practitioners
of the Religio. I'm not one of them, but it's not for lack of
fine example on the part of Pontifex Maximus Julianus and many other
good people.

Somewhere along the line you'd also be well advised to learn
who the various magistrates and Senators are. You can study
the Albums at the official website, and you can also read the
reports of Senate proceedings that get posted here just about
every month.

This year's consuls are Marcus Octavius Germanicus and Lucius
Cornelius Sulla. I haven't seen the junior consul around in
a few days, but Octavius has just posted earlier today and you'll
see him posting stuff just about every day. Octavius is also
the censor-elect for next year.

Next year's consuls are Caeso Fabius Quintilianus (this year's
senior Curule Aedile), and Titus Labienus Fortunatus, the current
senior praetor. (The other current praetor is Patricia Cassia,
and I'm the other current Curule Aedile.)

> ps how would feb.20,1967 and 2002 be written in Latin?

Let's do that by parts. Since the 20th of February comes
after the ides, you count backward from the kalends (1st
day) of March. Since neither of the years you're asking about
was a leapyear, the 20th will be the 8th day before the
kalends of March in both cases. That's written "ante diem
VIII kal Martis." Then you write out the years. As you note
the current year is 2755 a.u.c., or MMDCCLV a.u.c. 1967 was
35 years ago, making it 2720 a.u.c. or MMDCCXX a.u.c.

Now if you want to write out 2002, that's just MMII, while
1967 is MCMLXVII.

So, the date in this year is written:

ante diem VIII kal Martis MMDCCLV a.u.c.

And you can just substitute in one of the other year numbers
from above.

> (both literally
> and according to the Nova Roma dating of the years.)is it 2755 and
> how do you come up with that?

The Roman manner of reckoning the passing of years is since the
founding of the city of Rome, in 753 BCE. That's our Roman year 1.

You can read all about it at

http://www.clubs.psu.edu/aegsa/rome/romec.html

-- Marinus

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Subject:	[Nova-Roma] Re: Open Letter to the Praetor (Third Attempt)
From:	"pompeia_cornelia <scriba_forum@hotmail.com>" <scriba_forum@hotmail.com>
Date:	Mon, 09 Dec 2002 12:47:59 -0000

---Salvete Omnes:

The misunderstanding is from a response by you, Jamie
Johnston/Apollonius Novus, to Tarquitius, in this forum, in which you
stated that you were content to have this taken up in a more private
venue, after his request for this method of procedure. You indicated
to me that you saw where you did not accurately convey your true
wishes...that indeed you wanted this dealt with publicly.

As I result, I mentioned the matter to the Senate, and spoke with L.
Cornelius Sulla Consul privately about it.

My position is that nothing is 'libelous' until it is lawfully
determined as such by a man/women wearing the appropriate robe and
beholding a mallot of justice. My feelings were conveyed to the
appropriate parties as such and I am conveying them here now.

Even with the initial onset of this unfortunate situation, I was even
careful as Praetor not to label anything 'libelous' but
rather, 'potentially' so.

So, based on my understanding of your wishes/petition, I did follow
through with this.

I see you have failed to mention that, so I thought I would make the
populace aware that this was not something I ignored. I took the time
to follow this up with you after I had resigned, in keeping with my
conviction of honouring the commitments I could, even though I
couldn't conscienciously 'women' the list forum any longer.

Bene valete,
Pompeia Cornelia
Former Praetor

In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "A. Apollonius Cordus" <cordus@s...>
wrote:
> A. Apollonius Cordus to the Praetor T. Labienus
> Fortunatus and all citizens and peregrines, greetings.
>
> My thanks for your ruling in response to my petition.
>
> My intent in making it was not so much to have anyone
> ruled in or out of order as to ensure that everyone
> was being treated equitably by the same principles.
> This you have demonstrated amply, and so although my
> petition was denied, I am satisfied that justice has
> been done.
>
> Incidentally, I should make it clear to everyone that
> the delay in the Praetor's response was mainly due to
> a miscommunication on my part which I failed to spot,
> and not to any dereliction of duty on his part, or the
> part of any other magistrate, as I implied in my last
> message on this subject.
>
> Thanks again to the Praetor for his ruling and to
> everyone for their patience.
>
> =====
>
>
> www.strategikon.org
>
>
> __________________________________________________
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> Everything you'll ever need on one web page
> from News and Sport to Email and Music Charts
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Subject:	Re: [Nova-Roma] The Praetor Suffectus speaks-I concur
From:	PADRUIGTHEUNCLE@aol.com
Date:	Mon, 09 Dec 2002 09:00:29 -0500

The Praetor Suffectus speaks well and true. I concur and hope that my fellow citizens will do so as well.

Valete

F. Galerius Aurelianus Secundus

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Subject:	Re: [Nova-Roma] Inactive Senators and Augurs-Some thoughts
From:	PADRUIGTHEUNCLE@aol.com
Date:	Mon, 09 Dec 2002 09:26:26 -0500

>From F. Galerius Aurelianus Secundus to his friend G. Modius Athanasius. Salve.

It is indeed a conundrum. According to the laws and traditions of Old Rome, many religious positions could not be removed even though the person holding them was condemned or exiled. In my studies of the Arval Brethren, there are some who fled the Empire to preserve their lives but they were kept on the roll of the College regardless. I suppose that if a pontiff, augur, or other member of the religio resigned their citizenry or became "incommunicado in perpetuity" then they could be considered as "legally dead" or "non corpore" by the State. Under those circumstances, we could keep to the ancient traditions since someone who no longer exists under their NR name would be "dead." Of course, if someone should leave NR (for any reason) and they were declared "non corpore" after a year, what would we do if they were to later reactivate. Come in under a new name with a new gens but with a restriction that would prevent them from holding any 'life' position? keep them from holding such a position for 3,5, or 7 years? required the college of pontiffs or augurs to make the decision? Ah, such thoughts boggle my poor mind. I can only pray that I am never required to have to make such a decision myself. May the gods grant you good fortune. Vale.

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Subject:	Re: [Nova-Roma] Inactive Senators and Augurs-Some thoughts
From:	PADRUIGTHEUNCLE@aol.com
Date:	Mon, 09 Dec 2002 09:26:28 -0500


Subject:	Re: [Nova-Roma] Re: Nova!
From:	labienus@novaroma.org
Date:	Mon, 9 Dec 2002 08:32:58 US/Central

Salve Tite Iuni

> ps how would feb.20,1967 and 2002 be written in Latin?

A.d.X Kal Mar MMDCCXX AUC, which is short for ante diem decimum Kalendas
Martias MMDCCLV ab urbe condita. That translates to "the tenth day before the
Kalends of March, 2720 years after the founding of the city". 2002 is, indeed,
MMDCCLV, or 2755. More traditionally, it's the year of the consulship of M
Octavius and L Cornelius.

For a reasonably complete treatment of Roman dates, I suggest:
http://www.geocities.com/~stilicho/day.html
and:
http://www.geocities.com/~stilicho/year.html

Actually, I recommend the whole site as an excellent resource for any beginning
student of Roman history or Latin.

> (both literally
> and according to the Nova Roma dating of the years.)is it 2755 and
> how do you come up with that?

As implied above, the Nova Roman year 1 is 753 BCE, which is the year we
recognize for the founding of Rome. The actual date is, of course, not known
with any certainty, but 753 BCE is the traditionally accepted date and one's
calendar must start somewhere.

Vale
T Labienus Fortunatus

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Subject:	Re: [Nova-Roma] Inactive Senators and Augurs
From:	me-in-@disguise.co.uk
Date:	Mon, 9 Dec 2002 15:02:06 +0000 (GMT)

-----Original Message-----
>From : AthanasiosofSpfd@aol.com
>
>
>Inactivity hurts our Republic, especially with the augurs, as there are only
>so many augurs that can fill up that particular Collegium -- and there are
>only so many slots for Patricians and Plebeians.
>
Perhaps the status should remain for life as a broader pool containing the actually active even if this is not struiclty historical. Where individuals have left, their title will not matter to them anyway. Where they have not, it becomes de facto a courtesy title retirement title and another replaces them, with due warning. Ancient Rome must have suffered this problem, particularly with the more aged incapacitated augurs.

Caesariensis.

--
Personalised email by http://another.com

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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Subject:	[Nova-Roma] Digest No 337
From:	"Lucius Equitius" <vergil@starpower.net>
Date:	Mon, 9 Dec 2002 10:34:30 -0500

Salvete, Quirites

I'd like to comment on the subject, for me, I believe that I owe it to Nova
Roma, my colleague Senatores, and past and future holders of offices that I
hold or have held, to be better than I am as an 'average citizen'. I have
often
found strength in this ideal. Let me explain, when I've been faced with a
difficult decision
or found myself angry (I've a volatile temper), I take time to consider what
the person/magistrate should do versus what I *want* to do ;-) I listen to,
or
try to understand, an opposing idea or position before making a decision.

Perhaps Senator Q Fabius could have done a better job at explaining
what he meant. Perhaps he meant that Senatores took on the added
responsibility of being guardians of Nova Roma and remain relatively
constant in their vigilance. I know that I have considered this when there
have been candidates brought before us for Senate inclusion.

As G. Modius pointed out, "there are senators who are virtually inactive,
what about them?"
Well, they are to be removed from the Senate as they have done absolutely
nothing this year.
This will be done in accord with the law that becomes effective Kal Jan
MMDCCLVI (1 Jan, 2002).
http://www.novaroma.org/tabularium/leges/2002-02-27-iv.html

My colleague and I removed them this year, since they did nothing *last
year*(or the year before), but this was vetoed under the misguided idea that
it was contrary to the law, which does not exist now but becomes effective
next year.
Anyway, it wasn't worth the continued fighting over, so knowing that they
wouldn't pass the test and would be removed at the beginning of the next
term we
left it.

At any rate they didn't live up to the 'higher standard' of staying active
in Nova Roma society. They simply disappeared, one abdicating his position
as Paterfamias as his last contact with us.

Valete, Censor Lucius Equitius Cincinnatus

In a message dated 12/7/2002 6:38:46 AM Eastern Standard Time,
qfabiusmaxmi@a... writes:

> We hold ourselves up to a higher
> standard than the average citizen, yet we remain citizens all the same.
>

Q. Fabius Maximus:

I am curious as to which higher standards senators hold themselves. Are
there a hidden set of virtues that only senators are aware of, and that only
apply to senators? I have heard rumor that there are senators who are
virtually inactive, what about them? Have they relegated themselves to
"average citizen" with a title, or are they still of a higher standard?

>SNIP<

Vale,
G. Modius Athanasius
Flamen Pomonalis

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Subject:	[Nova-Roma] Digest No 339 Inactive Senators and Augurs
From:	"Lucius Equitius" <vergil@starpower.net>
Date:	Mon, 9 Dec 2002 10:38:09 -0500

Salvete,

Nice rant. This guy is doing a wonderful job telling us what wrong (as if no
one else hadn't brought these things up years ago). Trouble is he doesn't
have, or at least he hasn't shared them, any ideas what needs to be done to
fix the problems. I'm wondering if he'll do like so many others have done
when they can't change
everything to fit their (perfect) idea on how things should be, and
leave/quit/resign.

The Senate already has addressed what to do about inactive Senatores, and
*I*
have more than once brought before the College Pontificium the subject of
those people who have taken Augur positions and resigned citizenship.
I have proposed that those people who have left NovaRoma also resigned their
position and are in fact no longer Augures no matter that the Constitution
says "for life" because they were not forced to leave, they resigned, enough
said. In cases where a person leaves without a word, they could be
considered
'legally dead' after a sufficient period of time set by law. The idea of
3,5, or 7 years
has been mentioned by various citizens and any of them would be better than
the
situation as it stands.

Valete, Lucius Equitius Cincinnatus Augur
Censor, Senator, etc.
________________________________________________________________________

Message: 25
Date: Sun, 8 Dec 2002 17:59:46 EST
From: AthanasiosofSpfd@aol.com
Subject: Inactive Senators and Augurs

In a message dated 12/8/2002 10:33:22 AM Eastern Standard Time,
cassius622@aol.com writes:

> To be honest Nova Roma had never planned to deal with such non-
> participation. People enter the Senate specifically *because* they
> have been active in Nova Roma. It was thought that people would
> continue to be active once in the Senate, or they would quit of their
> own choice. Instead we've run into a situation where two individuals
> have gone inactive. When contacted they say "Yes, I still want to be
> a Senator!" Yet after such contact they are still not heard from.

Salve Cassius:

The issue of inactive senators is something that, to me, is a stain upon
Nova
Roma. It is no good to have citizens in leadership positions who do not
fulfill the minimum standards of their office.

I also think it is "insane" to have people occupying priesthood positions
that have left Nova Roma altogether. For example...Augurs are "for life."
Yet we have several augurs who are not even citizens anymore, yet they
remain
as augurs "officially." How do we (being those who wish to remain citizens)
even know that these inactive (yet official) augurs are even still alive.

I know that Senators and Augurs were positions "for life," but if we have
broken from tradition on several other points of Roman life, surely there
can
be some sort of "activity" clause to keep some sort of minimum standard of
activity. I think as long as someone is doing the job then their post as
senator or augur etc... should be guarded, but prolonged inactivity or
cancellation of membership (in the case of Augurs) should result in the loss
of the post...at least in my opinion.

Inactivity hurts our Republic, especially with the augurs, as there are only
so many augurs that can fill up that particular Collegium -- and there are
only so many slots for Patricians and Plebeians.

It is a sad state of affairs -- in my opinion -- when we have senators,
magistrates, pontiffs, augurs, etc... who are either inactive or who have
not
paid their taxes.

Ok...my rant is completed <G>. Sorry if I have offended anyone.

Vale;

G. Modius Athanasius

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Subject:	[Nova-Roma] Election for Tribune
From:	"gaiuspopilliuslaenas <ksterne@bellsouth.net>" <ksterne@bellsouth.net>
Date:	Mon, 09 Dec 2002 16:32:47 -0000

Salvete Quirites,

With the opening of the polls fast approaching, I just wish to
remind my fellow Plebians that their support for my candidacy for
Tribune will be greatly appreciated.

If anyone has a question they would prefer to ask in private, feel
free to e-mail me.

Valete,
Gaius Popilius Laenas
Consular Quaestor
Praefectus Regio Magna Flumen America Austrorientalis
Candidate for Tribune

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Subject:	[Nova-Roma] inactive senators and augurs
From:	"Gaius Galerius Peregrinator" <gaiusgalerius@hotmail.com>
Date:	Mon, 09 Dec 2002 16:59:07 +0000

Salvete omnes:

And talking about the Senate, deliberations are made behind closed
doors. It would be nice to know what happens there instead of every now and
then hear that there is disagreement, there is veto, there are accusations
about something or another but all in general terms so no to tell us.

Probably, there is a reason for the closed doors deliberations. But
since we have a newspaper now and an editor, why not let him into the
chambers and let him report to us of what's happening there. After all he
was elected by the people, and besides he is a Galerius which means he is
more than able. For those who are new to our Republic, that's a very
distinguished family in Novaroma, you must know.

Valete

G. Galerius Peregrinator.

_________________________________________________________________
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Subject:	Re: [Nova-Roma] inactive senators and augurs
From:	"L. Sicinius Drusus" <lsicinius@yahoo.com>
Date:	Mon, 9 Dec 2002 09:35:46 -0800 (PST)

The Tribunes are allready allowed to listen to the
Senate's debates as the representives of the people,
and are charged with the duty of keeping the people
informed on the Senate's business. Adding the editor
of the newpaper would do no more than duplicate a
safegaurd that is allready in place.

--- Gaius Galerius Peregrinator
<gaiusgalerius@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> Salvete omnes:
>
> And talking about the Senate, deliberations are
> made behind closed
> doors. It would be nice to know what happens there
> instead of every now and
> then hear that there is disagreement, there is veto,
> there are accusations
> about something or another but all in general terms
> so no to tell us.
>
> Probably, there is a reason for the closed doors
> deliberations. But
> since we have a newspaper now and an editor, why not
> let him into the
> chambers and let him report to us of what's
> happening there. After all he
> was elected by the people, and besides he is a
> Galerius which means he is
> more than able. For those who are new to our
> Republic, that's a very
> distinguished family in Novaroma, you must know.
>
> Valete
>
> G. Galerius Peregrinator.
>
>
>
>
_________________________________________________________________
> MSN 8 helps eliminate e-mail viruses. Get 2 months
> FREE*.
> http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus
>
>

=====
L. Sicinius Drusus

Roman Citizen

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Subject:	[Nova-Roma] Verified Spyware Warning (Please Read!)
From:	"Chantal G. Whittington" <aerdensrw@yahoo.com>
Date:	Mon, 9 Dec 2002 09:39:42 -0800 (PST)

I just received this in an email from my father. It
is a warning about egreeting cards which are
apparently being used as a means of collecting email
addresses and installing unwanted software on your
computer. Please read this and beware of these ecards
if you get them from the companies shown below.

---
Chantal

From: "GAUDIANO, SAVERIO (JSC-EV) (NASA)
To: "'CHANTAL'" <AERDENSRW@YAHOO.COM>
Subject: Electronic Greeting Cards
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 2002 09:55:26 -0600

This is "social engineering" at its most insidious!
While seemingly innocuous, these all perform actions
that could have serious consequences, bypassing and
changing the security controls on the desktop. It
takes little additional effort to drop a Trojan or
delete all files on a computer.

This was checked out at
http://www.snopes.com/computer/virus/friend.htm
and confirmed as being true.

Beware of Greeting Card Spyware

Just in Time for the Holidays: Those cute little
electronic greeting cards you occasionally get from
friends may be a real problem. The ones I'm speaking
of are those where there's a link that says "[Some
Name] has sent you a greeting card. Go here to get
your greeting card."

There's a new card company called
"FriendGreetings.com" When you get a card
notification from them and click on the link, it will
take you to their site. You will be notified that you
have to install an ActiveX control in order to view
the card.

When you begin to install, the first thing that pops
up is what is known as a "EULA" (End User License
Agreement). It is very long, and you will not read it.
They're counting on that. When you scroll to the
bottom of it and click "Accept," you have agreed to
the terms of the EULA.

Part of what you will have agreed to is to have
monitoring/spyware software installed on your computer

which will periodically report a vast array of data
back to the card company.

The other part that you've agreed to is to have the
software send mail to every address in your
address-book (if you are using Outlook or Outlook
Express).

Please do not respond to these eGreeting cards. The
following is a list of sources that you should not
respond to:

friend-card.com
friend-card.net
friend-cards.com
cool-downloads.com
cool-downloads.net
friend-greet.com
friend-greeting.com
friend-greeting.net
friend-greetings.com
friend-greetings.net
friend-cards.net
laugh-mail.com

Paul T Wilson
NASA/Johnson Space Center
Deputy I/T Security Manager

=====
Chantal
http://www.4dw.net/aerden/theran/theranweyr.html

"Yesterday, it worked.
Today, it is not working.
Windows is like that."

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Subject:	Re: [Nova-Roma] Verified Spyware Warning (Please Read!)
From:	"L. Sicinius Drusus" <lsicinius@yahoo.com>
Date:	Mon, 9 Dec 2002 09:58:50 -0800 (PST)

Salvete,

Spyware is an increasing problem for people who use
Windows computers. Most of the "file sharing" programs
that people use to trade music, videos, and programs
over the internet also install spyware on your
computer.

There is a progran called "Ad-Aware" that detects and
removes spyware programs from your computer. Some of
the free downloads that install spyware are written so
they will no longer function if you remove the spyware
they installed, so using Ad-Aware may cause "file
sharing" and other free downloads to stop working.

Ad-Aware is a free download from Lavasoft.
http://www.lavasoftusa.com/

I Recomend it to all users of Windows.

--- "Chantal G. Whittington" <aerdensrw@yahoo.com>
wrote:
> I just received this in an email from my father. It
> is a warning about egreeting cards which are
> apparently being used as a means of collecting email
> addresses and installing unwanted software on your
> computer. Please read this and beware of these
> ecards
> if you get them from the companies shown below.
>
> ---
> Chantal
>
>
> From: "GAUDIANO, SAVERIO (JSC-EV) (NASA)
> To: "'CHANTAL'" <AERDENSRW@YAHOO.COM>
> Subject: Electronic Greeting Cards
> Date: Mon, 9 Dec 2002 09:55:26 -0600
>
> This is "social engineering" at its most insidious!
> While seemingly innocuous, these all perform actions
> that could have serious consequences, bypassing and
> changing the security controls on the desktop. It
> takes little additional effort to drop a Trojan or
> delete all files on a computer.
>
> This was checked out at
> http://www.snopes.com/computer/virus/friend.htm
> and confirmed as being true.
>
> Beware of Greeting Card Spyware
>
> Just in Time for the Holidays: Those cute little
> electronic greeting cards you occasionally get from
> friends may be a real problem. The ones I'm speaking
>
> of are those where there's a link that says "[Some
> Name] has sent you a greeting card. Go here to get
> your greeting card."
>
> There's a new card company called
> "FriendGreetings.com" When you get a card
> notification from them and click on the link, it
> will
> take you to their site. You will be notified that
> you
> have to install an ActiveX control in order to view
> the card.
>
> When you begin to install, the first thing that pops
> up is what is known as a "EULA" (End User License
> Agreement). It is very long, and you will not read
> it.
> They're counting on that. When you scroll to the
> bottom of it and click "Accept," you have agreed to
> the terms of the EULA.
>
> Part of what you will have agreed to is to have
> monitoring/spyware software installed on your
> computer
>
> which will periodically report a vast array of data
> back to the card company.
>
> The other part that you've agreed to is to have the
> software send mail to every address in your
> address-book (if you are using Outlook or Outlook
> Express).
>
> Please do not respond to these eGreeting cards. The
> following is a list of sources that you should not
> respond to:
>
> friend-card.com
> friend-card.net
> friend-cards.com
> cool-downloads.com
> cool-downloads.net
> friend-greet.com
> friend-greeting.com
> friend-greeting.net
> friend-greetings.com
> friend-greetings.net
> friend-cards.net
> laugh-mail.com
>
> Paul T Wilson
> NASA/Johnson Space Center
> Deputy I/T Security Manager
>
> =====
> Chantal
> http://www.4dw.net/aerden/theran/theranweyr.html
>
> "Yesterday, it worked.
> Today, it is not working.
> Windows is like that."
>
>
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up
> now.
> http://mailplus.yahoo.com
>

=====
L. Sicinius Drusus

Roman Citizen

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Subject:	Re: [Nova-Roma] COMITIA PLEBIS TRIBUTA is convened
From:	"=?iso-8859-1?q?A.=20Hirtius=20Helveticus?=" <hirtius75ch@yahoo.de>
Date:	Mon, 9 Dec 2002 18:50:51 +0100 (CET)

Salvete Quirites

It is now Monday, Dec 9th 18:50 Roman Time and the
Cista is not yet open...

Valete bene,

=====
A. Hirtius Helveticus
-------------------------
"Res Romana Dei est, terrenis non eget armis."
(Corippus, In laudem Iustini 3, 328)
-------------------------
http://www.hirtius.ch.tt/
-------------------------

__________________________________________________________________

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Subject:	[Nova-Roma] Just a thought on the inactive Augers
From:	"quintuscassiuscalvus <richmal@attbi.com>" <richmal@attbi.com>
Date:	Mon, 09 Dec 2002 16:50:43 -0000

Salve,

This is just a thought but section VI. paragraph b. of the
Constitution contains the statement: "Only Citizens of Nova Roma may
be members of the public institutions of the Religio Romana, which
shall be organized, and have their responsibilities divided, as
follows:"

If someone has resigned their citizenship would that not make him/her
ineligible to retain the office of Auger by virtue that only a
Citizen may be an auger (as well as other religious offices)? For
those that do not formally resign, but just slide away into the
nether realms of cyberspace the periodic census removing the "virtual
dead" from the citizenship roles would thusly removing them from the
office of Auger.

Vale,

Quintus Cassius Calvus

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Subject:	[Nova-Roma] Re: (Nice Rant) was Inactive Senators and Augurs
From:	"pompeia_cornelia <scriba_forum@hotmail.com>" <scriba_forum@hotmail.com>
Date:	Mon, 09 Dec 2002 20:25:34 -0000

---Salvete Omnes:

I hope this doesn't send you for a complete loop, Censor L. Equitius,
but in part of this post I am forced to agree with you.

All I am seeing with candidate Modius is a statement of problems,
which have already been assigned solutions, or items which have
mentioned by others already, without proposed solutions.

The dormant Senators were dealt with 'many moons ago', for example.

That Senators and magistrates should strive to show virtuous examples
is not something you will be able to do alot about, except in the
mastery of your own conduct and example.

As I person who felt she could not carry on with the list moderation,
yes, I surrendered my position.

However, there are other tribunal candidates who are atleast privy to
entertain that there are sides of a given situation they may not know
about, and hesitate to render judgement without full knowledge of all
the facts.
These are men of wisdom.....not necessarily because they agree with
me in my case, and perhaps they do not, but that they are open to
hearing the facts before they render a robotic-type judgment....no
hearing, no trial, no jury, notta.

Message 4091 clearly shows me that you would not exactly be the
*first* person to which I would appeal a case of provacatio :)

Tolerance from the top down, you write in 4091? Ohh, let's
slough 'all' the responsibility of virtue onto Senators and
magistrates, shall we? No. Virtue and tolerance (the latter is a
virtue) begins with each one of us.

If this is also a part of the campaign platform, I am even less
impressed.

If you think upon election (and this is not an endorsement by any
means) that you will suddenly undergo this metamorphosis into
a 'lean, mean virtuous machine", capable of leaping all boundaries,
magically repairing any dilemna, making everyone happy as *well* as
considering the general wellbeing of the republic, you are sadly
mistaken. You will find that, alas, you are still human, with only
the same degree of skills, the same blood, the same brain power as
you had before...this time you will have people dependent upon you to
be tribune to all of them, or attend to 'their' unique situation if
they call upon you for counsel. That is, if you intend on doing what
you are supposed to do, as Tribune.

There is 'my' rant, G. Modius, candidate Tribunus Plebis.

Pomp

In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "Lucius Equitius" <vergil@s...> wrote:
> Salvete,
>
> Nice rant. This guy is doing a wonderful job telling us what wrong
(as if no
> one else hadn't brought these things up years ago). Trouble is he
doesn't
> have, or at least he hasn't shared them, any ideas what needs to be
done to
> fix the problems. I'm wondering if he'll do like so many others
have done
> when they can't change
> everything to fit their (perfect) idea on how things should be, and
> leave/quit/resign.
>
> The Senate already has addressed what to do about inactive
Senatores, and
> *I*
> have more than once brought before the College Pontificium the
subject of
> those people who have taken Augur positions and resigned
citizenship.
> I have proposed that those people who have left NovaRoma also
resigned their
> position and are in fact no longer Augures no matter that the
Constitution
> says "for life" because they were not forced to leave, they
resigned, enough
> said. In cases where a person leaves without a word, they could be
> considered
> 'legally dead' after a sufficient period of time set by law. The
idea of
> 3,5, or 7 years
> has been mentioned by various citizens and any of them would be
better than
> the
> situation as it stands.
>
> Valete, Lucius Equitius Cincinnatus Augur
> Censor, Senator, etc.
>
______________________________________________________________________
__
>
> Message: 25
> Date: Sun, 8 Dec 2002 17:59:46 EST
> From: AthanasiosofSpfd@a...
> Subject: Inactive Senators and Augurs
>
> In a message dated 12/8/2002 10:33:22 AM Eastern Standard Time,
> cassius622@a... writes:
>
> > To be honest Nova Roma had never planned to deal with such non-
> > participation. People enter the Senate specifically *because* they
> > have been active in Nova Roma. It was thought that people would
> > continue to be active once in the Senate, or they would quit of
their
> > own choice. Instead we've run into a situation where two
individuals
> > have gone inactive. When contacted they say "Yes, I still want to
be
> > a Senator!" Yet after such contact they are still not heard from.
>
> Salve Cassius:
>
> The issue of inactive senators is something that, to me, is a stain
upon
> Nova
> Roma. It is no good to have citizens in leadership positions who
do not
> fulfill the minimum standards of their office.
>
> I also think it is "insane" to have people occupying priesthood
positions
> that have left Nova Roma altogether. For example...Augurs are "for
life."
> Yet we have several augurs who are not even citizens anymore, yet
they
> remain
> as augurs "officially." How do we (being those who wish to remain
citizens)
> even know that these inactive (yet official) augurs are even still
alive.
>
> I know that Senators and Augurs were positions "for life," but if
we have
> broken from tradition on several other points of Roman life, surely
there
> can
> be some sort of "activity" clause to keep some sort of minimum
standard of
> activity. I think as long as someone is doing the job then their
post as
> senator or augur etc... should be guarded, but prolonged inactivity
or
> cancellation of membership (in the case of Augurs) should result in
the loss
> of the post...at least in my opinion.
>
> Inactivity hurts our Republic, especially with the augurs, as there
are only
> so many augurs that can fill up that particular Collegium -- and
there are
> only so many slots for Patricians and Plebeians.
>
> It is a sad state of affairs -- in my opinion -- when we have
senators,
> magistrates, pontiffs, augurs, etc... who are either inactive or
who have
> not
> paid their taxes.
>
> Ok...my rant is completed <G>. Sorry if I have offended anyone.
>
> Vale;
>
> G. Modius Athanasius

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Subject:	[Nova-Roma] Re: Citizens and Senators
From:	"sceptia <sceptia@yahoo.es>" <sceptia@yahoo.es>
Date:	Mon, 09 Dec 2002 21:45:55 -0000

Salve Honorable Fabius Maximus

--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, qfabiusmaxmi@a... wrote:
> In a message dated 12/8/02 3:23:53 AM Pacific Standard Time,
>
> That was not me, that was Sinicus. But I know your posture on the
Gens > reform lex.> And you are entitled to your opinion.

SCE: Then my memory is not as good as I thought. Thanks for your
words. :-)

> Your English is so good I thought you were an American. I
apologize :-)

SCE: I wish I spoke so good english!! As far as Latin is far away
from my knowledge and Spanish, being it a latin derivated languague
is limited to some million people, I try to make me understand. But
do not say my english is so good, please... :-)

> The SCA is an organization of people dedicated to understanding the
early and > late medieval period. They dress up in medieval dress.
They celebrate > medieval traditional holidays.
> The big excuse for this organization in my view, is for the men to
fight each > other using rattan weapons and metal armor for
protection. I was an off and > on member for 20 years. I fought
sword and shield when time allowed. I had > several "squires" boys
who would tend my armor pitch my tent etc. In return > I would spar
with them, teach fighting technique, instruct them in history.> Vet
means Veteran.

SCE: That is an answer. Thanks for it. :-)
But another question would be how you changed from medieval times to
ancient times? what motivated you to do so? If you wish to reply it,
maybe would be better to do privately, don't really know...

> Well, forgive my skepticism. An American trait of mine when it
comes to > politics.
> Talking to me makes you very visible on the main list. If I
mistook your > questioning for political advantage, that's my fault.
Platform BTW means > what your political solutions are going to be so
the people will elect you.

SCE: Talking to you or any other citizen can make me visible as far
as the contents of the dialogue could be quality ones... again I
disagree on your (Seems to me) conceptions on personal importance.
My solutions are quite clear. Respect to the law, to the idea of Nova
Roma, to the purposes of it. And maybe the following days I would
talk about it in extense... remember I must be demagogic as election
times approach again. :-)

> > SCE: Sure I did not walked on your moccasins, but I have tried.
> > Because not being a Consular Magistrate I can figure myself and
> > picture what could it be, and I read the List, and... so I can
figure > > a little what can it be.
> >
> True, but you really can't.

SCE: Can't I really? A little comparation.
If I can't really figure what you must behave as Senator, etc, we,
you, Nova Roma and me the whole thing can't be true romans. Can't
know a praetor, a senator, a consul should behave or behaved indeed!!
That seems a little unheartened, didn't it?
I really can figure what the duties are, what kind of problems it
brings, what to do... do not subestimate the imagination power (And
the cleverness of any other citizen :-))
Again is the individual, not the office. :-)

> And I told you have been here for five years and was involved in
political > change from the start. I also served an accenus for
Aediles, Praetors, and a > Consul when I started out for my first
year and 1/2. So I for me NR is a > second home. I want to see it
succeed.

SCE: Both wants the same... in the same way?

> Ah but a disagree with you. The seat inspires you to do better.

SCE: Means the pressure? Maybe. Means a holy or sacred vision? I
doubt so (remember I'm skeptical too). Means the duties? The
individual deals with it, not the seat... Maybe I half disagree or
half agree, as you like more. ;-)

> "Be" engaged I don't plan to marry you :-)

SCE: Pity! A marriage can do many more things than a single... if
agree. ;-)

> My father died while I was Consul, and my sister was in terrible
auto > accident.

SCE: Sorry to hear about.

> My Co Consul will tell you I never missed a meeting or a vote
during those > trying times. It is all part of the office and
commitment as my gensmate is > about to find out.

SCE: I just tried to point out that we all sacrifices a part of our
live and of our time for it, but is not only the time but the quality
of it... :-)

A pleasure to talk with you, Maximus, even if we are disagree (maybe
that's the idea). I hope then you support my candidature now, or if
you don't, suggest me properly what to do. As I said before "baiting"
you, I wish to hear all and then act. :-)

Vale bene,

L. Didius Geminus Sceptius

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Subject:	Re: [Nova-Roma] Verified Spyware Warning (Please Read!)
From:	"L. Sicinius Drusus" <lsicinius@yahoo.com>
Date:	Mon, 9 Dec 2002 14:01:00 -0800 (PST)

--- me-in-@disguise.co.uk wrote:
> -----Original Message-----
> From : “L. Sicinius Drusus“ <lsicinius@yahoo.com>
> >
> >Spyware is an increasing problem for people who use
> >Windows computers. Most of the “file sharing“
> programs
> >that people use to trade music, videos, and
> programs
> >over the internet also install spyware on your
> >computer.
> >
> Get a nice free Linux: far more versatile, any GUI
> you care to put on it, cheap to maintain and runs
> the Internet anyway.
>
> Caesariensis.
>
I Prefer Linux myself, though software devlopment
means I have to continue to use Windows too. Some
people prefer Windows either because they are more
familiar with it, or because they require some special
software that isn't available for Linux. My advice was
intended for these people.

That being said, Operating systems are a bit off topic
for a Roman list, so I hope any who wish to continue
to discuss them will make use of the Back Alley or the
Taverna.

=====
L. Sicinius Drusus

Roman Citizen

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Subject:	Re: [Nova-Roma] Verified Spyware Warning (Please Read!)
From:	me-in-@disguise.co.uk
Date:	Mon, 9 Dec 2002 23:11:10 +0000 (GMT)

-----Original Message-----
>From : “L. Sicinius Drusus“ <lsicinius@yahoo.com>
>
>That being said, Operating systems are a bit off topic
>for a Roman list, so I hope any who wish to continue
>to discuss them will make use of the Back Alley or the
>Taverna.
>
It is a matter of whether to buy your slaves from the mighty standardised Emporium Volpotestatis Portuum or from the Consortium Unicum Mixtorum I suppose.

Caesariensis.

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Subject:	Re: [Nova-Roma] Verified Spyware Warning (Please Read!)
From:	me-in-@disguise.co.uk
Date:	Mon, 9 Dec 2002 21:49:24 +0000 (GMT)

-----Original Message-----
>From : “L. Sicinius Drusus“ <lsicinius@yahoo.com>
>
>Spyware is an increasing problem for people who use
>Windows computers. Most of the “file sharing“ programs
>that people use to trade music, videos, and programs
>over the internet also install spyware on your
>computer.
>
Get a nice free Linux: far more versatile, any GUI you care to put on it, cheap to maintain and runs the Internet anyway.

Caesariensis.

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Subject:	[Nova-Roma] Re: Election for Tribune
From:	"pompeia_cornelia <scriba_forum@hotmail.com>" <scriba_forum@hotmail.com>
Date:	Mon, 09 Dec 2002 20:47:41 -0000

---Ave Gai Popilli Quaestor Nova Roma:

I wish you well in this campaign. You will be a fair, virtuous
person in the execution of the office of Tribune.

I hope the plebian populace does not forget that you were one of the
two Quaestors who were first reponsible for the collection and proper
dispersement of taxes to the central treasury.

If this doesn't speak for your honesty, skill and credibility, what
does?

Bene valete,
Pompeia

In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "gaiuspopilliuslaenas <ksterne@b...>"
<ksterne@b...> wrote:
> Salvete Quirites,
>
> With the opening of the polls fast approaching, I just wish to
> remind my fellow Plebians that their support for my candidacy for
> Tribune will be greatly appreciated.
>
> If anyone has a question they would prefer to ask in private, feel
> free to e-mail me.
>
> Valete,
> Gaius Popilius Laenas
> Consular Quaestor
> Praefectus Regio Magna Flumen America Austrorientalis
> Candidate for Tribune

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